100: Celebrating IBC Success with Real Clients

100 Celebrating IBC Success with Real Clients

[00:00:00] Hello, everyone. I'm John Montoya, and I'm John Perrings. We're authorized Infinite Banking Practitioners and hosts of the Strategic Whole Life Podcast.

John Perrings: Hello, everyone. Welcome to the Strategic Whole Life Podcast. This is a landmark episode number 100 for us. So we're in the triple digits and we wanted to do a special episode today. And so we're doing a little, a small round table with, two of our best clients, one of mine and one of John Montoya's.

And, we thought it'd be fun to just talk a little bit about, their lives and what they're doing with IBC and how it's been beneficial for them. so on the call, we have, of course, John Montoya. We have Declan Wilson here in the Bay, local Bay area. he's a, owns a contracting company and we have Brant Scheifler, who's from North Carolina, who is an SEO expert. And gents wanted [00:01:00] to say thank you upfront for taking some time to do this episode with us. we're really excited to have you on.

Declan Wilson: Thank you.

Brant Scheifler: yeah, thanks for having us.

John Perrings: I guess we could just jump right into it. Why don't we start with Declan? Declan, maybe you could just tell us a little bit about yourself, like what you do and, how you found IBC and what kind of piqued your interest in it.

Declan Wilson: Yeah, I'm a general contractor in the San Francisco Bay Area and,

John Montoya: Infinite

Declan Wilson: became familiar with, IBC is a pretty modern way. I found it on TikTok.

John Montoya: new concept.

Declan Wilson: I, was scrolling through one night and I happened to see a guy who was leaning towards, putting money into CDs. he explained, a few.

Do you pay 30, 000 for a truck if you have 30, 000 cash or do you do something with the cash and [00:02:00] finance the purchase? So I went through the motions with that and the guy's, like the guy's ideas and just clicked through a few of his other postings and, One of the suggestions was to read, How to Become Your Own Banker, which is, what's brought me here today.

John Perrings: Very cool. Very cool. Anything in particular, when you read Becoming Your Own Banker, anything particular stand out like, specifically for you and what you do in your life?

Declan Wilson: Yeah, I'm, I'm always trying to advance more into the, development or real estate end of, construction. And, along with, along with everything else in the Bay Area, everything's just so expensive. It seems that, [00:03:00] The bigger challenge for the most part. it was whenever I learned that you can use the same dollar one, two, three times, maybe that, I was, definitely became interested in it.

I was always vaguely aware of, how banking worked and how they only needed a small amount of that money to actually allow you to allow them to borrow it. Or lend it to you. whenever I started, reading the book, I figured that I'd like to be on that end of the business rather on the one that's the one taking the loan.

So

John Perrings: Right.

Declan Wilson: that's what I learned from it,

John Perrings: that's pretty awesome. I hadn't really thought of the, I've never really thought of that angle of, if prices are high for the thing you want [00:04:00] to buy, if you can reuse the same dollar over and over again, it could make some of those higher priced, assets a little more palatable.

so that's a pretty interesting take.

 Montoya, anything you want to add to what Declan was talking about? You're also in the real estate world. What are your thoughts on that?

John Montoya: I, what really caught me is, he learned about IBC from, being on TikTok. that's an

John Perrings: Declan doesn't come off as a TikToker, does he?

John Montoya: no, but, that just goes to show

Declan Wilson: It was during COVID, I had a little bit more time on my hands.

John Perrings: Yeah. Yeah.

John Montoya: yeah. I, think it's great that, just goes to show that we have the availability of so much info, information literally at our fingertips and. For, so many people. there, there's [00:05:00] unfortunately, when it comes to whole life there, there's a lot of misinformation out there, but you were able to grab on to something that piqued your interest and pointed you in the right direction.

And I think from there, curiosity, really led you to the book. And once you read the book, then, Maybe, you could share a little bit about, your experience reading the book. I'll just real quickly say one thing about Nelson's book. When I read it the first time, it was unlike any other finance book that I'd ever come across, with what it taught.

was there anything that pulled you in even further that maybe clicked right away with his book?

Declan Wilson: Yeah, it was just, it's as much the generational part of it as for what I can do with myself, the worst case scenario, I die and my dependents are covered, all the other advantages of [00:06:00] IBC. it's all, great, but at the end of the day, I'm able to say if anything ever happens to me, my children.

And if my wife is still around or going to be taken care of, that's what kind of jumped out to me with it. it is, I had term insurance and, whole life is more expensive, but it's, obviously a better investment where, term has a time limit. Whole life is whole life,

John Perrings: Yeah. It's an asset versus a liability. There are a lot of people who hear about IBC and they get really focused on the cash value aspect of it, but I really like what you said about the generational aspect and the, value of the death benefit, which is, By the way, where cash value comes from.

you can't separate the two and the fact that you, valued both, I, think probably just makes it that much easier for you [00:07:00] to, practice the infinite banking concept.

Declan Wilson: Yeah.

John Perrings: What about you, Brant? Let's kick it over to you.

Brant Scheifler: Sure, I was trying to think through exactly the first time I heard about IBC and how that came about. I think it was a few things that kind of started coming together, but as a small business owner. really, something that I think is very different is that you, have to think through how you're going to plan important elements of your future on your own.

You don't have an employer that is putting forth a 401k. even, disability policies or life insurance policies, sometimes those are, Supplied by an employer. And I was thinking through some of those things, but specifically I was thinking about the retirement piece and, what piqued my interest about [00:08:00] IBC is that, I've always been drawn to alternative and non mainstream things ever since I was young, I'm not really sure why, but I just really disliked the idea of stock market investing and the non guaranteed nature of it, and just locking money up over here that you just.

Can't touch, obviously you can touch it with a penalty. And so I really liked the guaranteed nature of IBC in terms of planning for just the base level of retirement, maybe not everything needed for retirement, but just like the foundation for it. But along with doing that, the ability to manage liquidity and other objectives at the exact same time.

And so that's really what drew me in and, I think a tangible example you always hear that Declan mentioned too is just the whole car example of, what's the best way to purchase a car. And so that was, really cool. In fact, I'm ready to [00:09:00] do that here shortly. But yeah, I just was drawn to it and thankfully, because John was mentioned, mentioning that it's a different paradigm and it truly is.

And so it me, a little while for me to, for it to click. And thankfully it did because I almost, went with a really bad product before knowing exactly what IBC was and wasn't. Indexed Universal Life. I almost did one of those policies and thankfully I, didn't do it.

not that can't be unwound. And then second, I was actually at a Starbucks working one day, so it's 10 years ago, and overheard an agent talking to someone else about IBC type policies and I was like, could that really be what he's talking about? So when he was done [00:10:00] with his appointment, I asked him about it and he's Oh yeah, that's.

Probably the easiest lead he ever got, right? Just someone approaching him, but, he was talking about taking out car loans, not paying them back, having short pay period. And in hindsight, I'm super glad that I didn't follow through with him because he wasn't an authorized IBC guy. yeah, when I finally read Nelson's book, set a baseline for.

what it isn't, and then how to get connected with a real IBC person, which eventually happened when I met John

John Perrings: that kind of ties into the next questions about, misconceptions. were there any, You just mentioned one, Brant, were there any other kind of misconceptions that were put out there?

And I'm sure Declan has some watching TikTok, but we'll start with you, Brant. Anything you had to overcome in your mind [00:11:00] to, get your head around the idea of what we're really trying to do?

Brant Scheifler: I think for me, I had an understanding of term insurance, obviously, probably everyone, and I had a term policy and still do. I just didn't know enough about the mechanics of, the right way to do it versus the wrong way to do it. And so it wasn't so much a misconception as it was just trying to understand what an IBC policy should look like and what it shouldn't look like.

And, I was thinking about that earlier is because like the reason why there's imitations is because there's a real thing. and so because of the real IBC product, and thankfully this was pre TikTok and pre Twitter, blowing up, because I wasn't bombarded with imitations, right and left where I had to sort through it.

[00:12:00] But, for me, it was just trying to understand okay, what exactly. Is the right structure for this and what isn't, what matters and what doesn't. And, thankfully. In working with John, I didn't have to fully understand all of the minute details. He did, and explained them to me. I didn't fully understand all of it.

And then later, listening to podcasts, re reading the book, I, get it now, what should be present and what shouldn't, but for example, for a little while, I, was super hung up on this whole 90 10 structure, I just was caught in this recommended content of this 90 10 guy on YouTube. And, so again, not a misconception, but it's what matters and what doesn't when it comes to executing this strategy.

And so that's something that I had to just, learn with time and then, through the right advice.

John Montoya: Yeah, I like tothink there is a silver lining to [00:13:00] everything. Unfortunately there are advisors out there that, missed the, bigger picture about IBC and they, put more emphasis on things like that 90-10 design or, what kind of Companies quote unquote have the biggest dividends and, all things that if you just go back to fundamentals and basics, really have nothing to do with what we're solving for.

what, is the problem that Nelson encountered, in his own life? And really that we all do, which is being able to have, access to our own money, whenever we need it or want it. And. Still maintaining the ability to, grow an asset at the same time. And, so there, there is a silver lining, I think, to some of the bad stuff out there is that if, if like yourself, Brant, [00:14:00] you recognize that, that there's an algorithm out there pointing you in a certain direction, but if you can do even just a little bit of critical thinking, which, IBC forces you to do when you go down that rabbit hole, you start to ask questions.

And if, you stay on that, that, quest for more knowledge and better answers, we're going to ask also better questions. And I think ultimately, if you didn't find us, this particular podcast, or maybe other IBC podcasts, practitioners who have their own podcast, you eventually do, and it steers you in the right direction.

And, I like to think that IBC and Whole Life specifically, it's like truth serum, because at the end of the day, it's math. And it's guaranteed, to perform in a, very specific way every single year for the rest of your life. And you [00:15:00] can't mess with that truth. and it, however, listeners, Find us, I, think the, at the end of the day, we try to stay true to Nelson's message and, just speak as best as we can to, the, truth that's inherent in not only whole life policies, but, the practicality of the IBC message and being your own banker.

I appreciate what you had to say, Brant. And I just wanted to share too, for our listeners, at least on my end, Brant, always forward thinking and, a podcast whisperer, if you will, on the back end, because he's, reached out to me a few times with some ideas for the show.

And, he's a Breaking Bad fan. and so we, we had an episode where we talked about Breaking Bad and, Brian, I know you had some other ideas that you shared with me via email [00:16:00] that, we've also put into, actual ideas for the show.

real quickly, I want to interject and just say thank you publicly for, your participation on the backend. it's been great, all your feedback.

Brant Scheifler: Sure. Yeah, happy to help.

John Perrings: How about you, Declan? Anything you felt like you needed to work around or figure out before, you felt comfortable, either talking to someone or implementing

Declan Wilson: Yeah, yeah, I feel as the resident TikTok expert that, the best thing I did was, get off of it

do my own research and read the book and read it a couple of times. And, that's when, I started the good old Google search and came in contact with you. Yeah, [00:17:00] it giggles, it makes me giggle the times that I, I see different, like YouTubers or TikTokers that, even in my limited experience in IBC that are out there selling something that isn't IBC, but they're trying to say that it is IBC ish and, it's, all, it all seems to be people trying to make a quick buck, whereas my understanding of IBC.

Is, it's not a get, it's not a get rich quick scheme. It's, it's a patience exercise to build up to where you wanna be with it, where the policy's making more than what you're putting in. So that's, makes me feel all mature whenever I think that, that's the, tactics that I'm actually using in my life nowadays.

But, [00:18:00] yeah, the, it, is a little annoying that there is so many, people out there that, aren't IBC practitioners like yourselves and they're selling something that's not. And, again, the best thing that I did was, it's, it states in the book about, making sure to, find someone, an IBC practitioner and to, get in contact with them and to let them take over from that point.

And that's, it's the advice that I took from the book. And I think it's the best move that I've made as far as, going down this road, That's awesome. And I, the reading the book is, it's the source material. So like people that don't read the book, it's like, why wouldn't at least, get the perspective from, the founder and creator of the idea. And [00:19:00] I was just at the IBC think tank that we do, every year in Vegas and, , one of the great things is, the Nelson Nash Institute has spent a few years cleaning house, and has really focused the last few years on, discussing these very topics.

John Perrings: And, there, there were, there are a couple people, who are on TikTok now, and they're talking about the right things. I think things are changing a little bit on the, in the social media space, partly due to the Nelson Nash Institute. cleaning things up and starting to protect its brand a little bit better than it was, before maybe five years ago.

John Montoya: So Brant, I want to turn it over to you and ask you, since you've been practicing IBC, is there anything, maybe in particular or even, just rough edges where you found [00:20:00] that the practicing IBC has benefited you or your family?

Brant Scheifler: Oh, yeah, definitely. multiple ways. I would say just as a starting point, when I did get started, my first policy was set up where I was just doing 500 a month. And I did start small just to dip my toes in, understand how it works, start thinking in that way. I've since obviously added multiple policies and all that.

And expanded the system. But, I would say, so I think you guys have said this before. If you haven't, someone else has. It's not an original thought of mine, but, likening IBC to a Swiss army knife. So my son has a Swiss army knife and he really likes it. And so he'll carry it around with him. And surely everyone's familiar with one, but for the, maybe one person in the world that isn't, it's one knife, but there are [00:21:00] multiple, tools you could say on the same knife.

So you've got. A large knife, a couple smaller ones, then you have a nail file, got some scissors, there's a can opener, a corkscrew, tweezers, a toothpick. The idea is that you can have this one tool in your pocket and if you're camping or wherever you might be, if you run into a situation, you'll have something to deal with that situation instead of, bringing seven, eight things in your pocket.

So IBC really is like that for me and for us. I'm married with three kids, It's, first of all, really, I've benefited from it knowing that a huge chunk of our retirement is, totally planned and guaranteed. there's no market fluctuation with it at all. there's, there are incredible tax benefits to it as well.

And so that's, one piece, maybe the large knife. And, Going on from there, [00:22:00] typically you would need to be saving and setting aside money in all these different areas of your life. think of a Roth 401k or a Roth IRA, a sinking fund and traditional financial planning.

If you're going to buy a car or remodel your house or put a roof on in a few years, or, CapEx for a real estate investor and, the 529 plans for your kids. And it's not that you can't do those things, or that we don't do any of those things, but with one product, we have money going into several policies that literally accomplish all of those things at the same time. And what I found is that those things never happen all at the same time, statistically. And we can be saving money for retirement. But, it's tax time and I'm sure Declan sympathizes here. Like a lot of people look forward to tax time. I've never looked forward to tax time as a small business owner.

Like I always write a huge check every year. [00:23:00] but I don't sweat it. I just did that. And so that's taken care of through IBC. we drive older cars by design, got the whole luxury car thing out of my system. Years ago, you're going to have to buy one car, maybe two this year. I have three kids. One just had just finished braces.

Two are starting braces. One just got braces. One's getting them in a couple months. It's no big deal. IBC handles literally all of these things with one tool. And so it's, been tremendous. I would say that really the security and the peace of mind. the policy side of it is really big and it's hard to factor that into an ROI calculation that people seem to get really hung up on. Because it's let me just use the kids for example. two are girls, one's a boy. we think through and pray through plans for them and their [00:24:00] futures and we talk about that. But it's uncertain. we don't know exactly which direction they're all going to go. with policies set up for each of them, Whether it's a wedding, or it's tuition, or it's a vehicle, whatever.

that money can be used for multiple things. Depending upon what, life looks like for each of them. And then after they demonstrate competence and responsibility, they'll be able to own those policies. So it's, just such a cool way to plan for multiple things that you're aware of and things you aren't aware of in one place at the same time. And even while doing these various activities, I just referenced in the background, the uninterrupted compound growth of it for retirement. It's just happening the whole time. So it's, been really life changing as far as that goes in the financial sense. So I don't, know if I answered your question directly, but it will give

John Montoya: I [00:25:00] think you, you hit a grand slam by all means, Bran. I think anyone listening to that, there's a lot of nuggets to pull from what you just shared and, very apt, metaphor with the Swiss army knife too. that, that was really perfect for me. And, I think anyone. Listening is going to take a ton of value from what you just shared.

So thank you. yeah, I, kept on thinking to myself, we're, never in a worse place by having access to cash and every single life event that happens, every stage of life. It's there. And like you mentioned, it doesn't necessarily all happen all at once. but. I just go back to, you're never in a worse position by having access to cash and liquidity, that these policies provide.

it's, okay, how much do I need? And where do [00:26:00] I need to direct it? And it's there for you. in a day and age where so many people unfortunately lock up their, money tied up in assets, where, they, there's limited liquidity or you have to wait to a certain age just to access it.

here's something hiding in plain sight that, opens the door and relieves a lot of the headaches, the financial headaches. Headaches that you mentioned, quite pointedly, you can't, put an ROI on peace of mind and knowing that what you want to have happen is going to happen simply because you were forward thinking enough to allocate a portion of your assets in, this, in my opinion, a very boring, which is a good thing, place to park wealth.

John Perrings: Yeah, you said a couple things that resonated with me, which, [00:27:00] the first one is I'll, steal Montoya's line. everything you said really leads to everything we do leads to a peaceful existence. So he didn't say it. So I'm going to say it. And, the other side of it is you mentioned, How you can't calculate a rate of return on some of the things that you were talking about.

Montoya just mentioned that, what we do with life insurance is just math, which is true. What's not math is life. And so your overall financial picture cannot be calculated like a math equation. And, there are many, instances where, just in my personal life alone, my.

My whole life cash value has completely saved me and there's no way. And it also, propelled me into a new career, which is what I'm doing now. And, just from a. Pure financial perspective of my financial life. I'm doing, [00:28:00] way better than I ever was in any of my previous careers. I can't, how do I put a rate of return on that?

You can't. So I think those are just two excellent points on, what you're doing here. I'm excited to hear from Declan. I know Declan's been working hard, as a, a local con having a local contracting business, being involved in real estate. So I'd love to hear your perspective on this, Declan, in terms of like how you've been able to benefit from IBC in whole life.

Declan Wilson: Yeah, I think one of the key components of it is the liquidity of, the cash value of the policy. It's actually, as you said yourself, it's saved my bacon a couple of times with, yeah, just situations where people weren't paying me for my work. And it's unfortunate in this business, but sometimes whenever someone doesn't pay you for your [00:29:00] work, it's, the beginning of a long battle.

from time to time, I've unfortunately had to take, policy loans to just keep cash flow on the business. And, luckily I've been able to pay them back as, as Funds from the next job and from other jobs roll in. But it is just so valuable in the fact that, I just had to log into my policy.

there was no questions. What's this money for? It was just, how much do you need? Where do you want me to send it? And, Yeah.

I don't know about anybody else, but my, emails are bombarded day in and day out with people trying to loan me money. And it's, It's oh yeah, you're pre approved, but it's expensive and it's not money, it's not my money.[00:30:00]

Brant Scheifler: see been, priceless to me in the last year of just, unfortunately, as I said, had a couple of, situations where I didn't get paid and, my guys, my employees get paid, whether I get paid or not, and my suppliers have to be paid, whether I get paid or not. And, yeah.

Declan Wilson: As I say, a couple of times my, loans from the policy have, kept the doors open. yeah, it's, there's no price you can put on being able to reach in and getting your money. I have a couple of 401ks, IRAs, but they're, it's money that's just stashed away out of reach.

I can't, Get at it without paying penalties and what's the point in putting that money away in the first place if you're going to have to pay a penalty and increase taxes just to get your hands on it [00:31:00] again. that's, the invaluable part for me. I try not to take loans.

I'm trying to hold out to my policy gets mature and, what I want to be doing real estate wise, but again, a few, small loans here and there to keep the business going has been a lifesaver.

John Perrings: Yeah. To use Brant's line, what's the rate of return on keeping your business alive? And that's it, yeah.

do you calculate that? the, so we're talking to two business owners here and, if you're not a business owner and you earn your money through, W 2 wages, I think all of this applies to, W 2 wage earners as well, because, you may not have a client that doesn't pay you, but you may have a job that [00:32:00] stops paying you at some point.

I've, been around long enough. I've lived through, two, financial bubbles that have popped and layoffs happen and business gets interrupted. And, if COVID taught us anything, maybe it's not the world's worst idea to have some cash and where's the best place for cash to be sitting?

And, I think we've. Gone over that quite a bit. And I, Today's conventional financial advice really, really devalues the idea of having, being liquid and having cash. it's Hey, you gotta put your, gotta get your money at work. You gotta, beat inflation, all these different things.

And then, one thing happens and you have to liquidate all that stuff anyway, that was beating. How are you beating inflation when you have to, liquidate it, pay penalties, pay taxes, all that stuff. [00:33:00] I love all these points you guys are making.

John Montoya: Yeah, and I, want to piggyback on something that you just mentioned for, wage earners and, to really hopefully help wage earners, see that they are a business owner in a sense, because we're all managing our finances, even if you work for a corporation and you receive a W 2, you're still, IBC is responsible for your money, and the way that the current system exists is to outsource your money to someone else, and really with IBC, this is a way to pull back some of that responsibility, and to take ownership of it, and IBC Yeah, it's just, at, the end of the day, we all have to be responsible to ourselves, to our loved ones.

And what better vehicle to do that with than a whole life policy? Because it's a private contract [00:34:00] with another private entity, the mutual based life insurance companies. you, can't accomplish any of this by partnering with the government through your 401k IRAs, Brant, you mentioned 529s, If it's a government qualified vehicle, that's a, that's basically a, call it a contract with the government and, they're going to have their, benefits for those particular plans.

But at the end of the day, you're putting your trust and faith in a good old uncle Sam and, whatever your preferences are. I think that, having a private contract, with another private entity is invaluable. And, we're fortunate enough to have guests that are bringing home some really great points on, all the benefits that these whole life policies provide.

let's switch gears a little bit and, and [00:35:00] wrap up with this. Brandt, I'll start, with you. If you could give any advice to someone listening who is, Just coming into IBC for the first time, maybe they're on the fence. They've listened to a few episodes or, they're looking to pick up the book.

what kind of advice would you give that person?

Brant Scheifler: Sure. I would say, I'm an advocate of taking action and moving somewhat quickly in life, but I would say with this, it's important to slow down enough to where you begin to comprehend what IBC is and what it isn't before you take action. And so reading the book would be a really helpful thing.

and then I would say. And this isn't a plug for you guys. what I found is authorized IBC people are very, non territorial in the sense that they advocate for one another. so I'd say, if you go to the website, Nelson National [00:36:00] Institute website, and find a practitioner, an authorized practitioner, in your area, and actually John Montoya is not in my area, I'm across the country, but they're licensed in your area to begin a conversation there and to get some of your questions answered directly from somebody who It's required to give you the right answers, versus somebody on social media or in the comment section, for example, or on Reddit.

that's what I would say is to, understand what it isn't, and then talk with an IBC person. And then once you have the basis there, I would say the next step is to get started, and you can get started at a, to get started in the biggest policy way possible. Although Everyone can, test once you do get started.

You usually wish you'd started bigger, but at any rate, yeah, to get it rolling, while your health is in a place where, you can not have to worry about qualifying for the [00:37:00] policy and getting the, the best rating that you can.

John Montoya: Yeah, fantastic. And Declan, any, words of advice for people who may be sitting on the fence?

Declan Wilson: Yeah, I, I try to talk to a lot of, friends and associates about, IBC in general, and, all I can really say is read the book. it's, I think it's 92 pages, am I right? whenever I picked it up, I picked it up with an open mind, but at the same time, a little bit dubious because I'd never heard of Nelson Nash and why have I never heard of this?

if this is out here, why, is it not common knowledge and why is everybody not doing it? I had to make myself comfortable, halfway through the book, I couldn't put it down. And I couldn't wait. [00:38:00] So I was so excited about it that, the mature side of me kicked in and said, oh, slow down, take a breath here and maybe read this again.

And that's what I did. And, second time reading through it, I'm like, yeah, this is, for me. And, as I said, I reached out to an author. I made a Google search for an authorized, practitioner. And that's, how John Came into my life and, yeah,

John Perrings: that for some SEO, Brent?

Brant Scheifler: that's great.

Declan Wilson: So yeah, it's a great thing, I'm not fluent enough in it to break, break it down for everybody that I want to spread the word to.

And as I said, that's, read the book. [00:39:00] It's, a great read, but it's a short read. It's not like you're going to be sitting down for three months to try and finish the book, And, right after we started The Fifth Edition, which was a callback to the final, what we thought was the final edition of Nelson's book, that was the first, that was the previous name of our podcast, The Fifth Edition to honor that book. the Sixth Edition came out right after that, which is the Audible book.

John Perrings: So for those of you who don't. Enjoy reading. You can listen to the book now. So that was one of the reasons we changed to strategic whole life, amongst other reasons.

John Montoya: fantastic, gentlemen, thank you so much for, taking time out of your day, to share your thoughts and pearls of wisdom, not only with us, but with the entire audience, really does mean a lot to both of us, co host here, [00:40:00] John Perrings, any last thoughts you want to share with everyone?

John Perrings: No, I think, if you're out there thinking about things, whether you're a business owner, a W2 employee, just really listen to what these guys are saying. they've, lived through. some real life events and we've, I don't want to beat a dead horse, but you can't always calculate, the math on real life events and having liquidity and control over your capital, can really turn, something bad into something even good.

so I think. I think those were some of the most important takeaways from real, our real life IBC clients right here. great guys. thank you again for joining. for those of you listening out there, if any of this is resonating with you and you'd like to learn how this could apply in your life in particular, you can head over to strategicwholelife. com. You can book [00:41:00] a free 30 minute consultation with us right there, and we can talk about you and your life and how some of these, Some of these principles could apply for you, or if you're like, if you're like I was and want to just read as much as you can and learn as much as you can before talking to anyone, you can head over again to strategicwholelife.

com and you could get access to our online course IBC mastery. All right. Declan, Brant, John Montoya. Thanks a lot.

Brant Scheifler: thanks for having me.

Declan Wilson: Thank you.

John Montoya: Thank you.